| Author |
Message |
Ian Iveson
Guest
|
 Posted:
Sun Nov 28, 2004 12:09 am Post subject:
Re: Tube Damper???? |
|
|
"Stewart Pinkerton" <patent3@dircon.co.uk> wrote
| Quote: | The sound system in a MiG 25 is pretty bad, and it's all tubed!
|
MiG sound systems are exceptionally good, but the listening space
lets them down. No carpet, no soft furniture, thin walls and noisy
neighbours.
cheers, Ian
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Shiva
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 29, 2004 6:23 pm Post subject:
Re: Tube Damper???? |
|
|
"JamesG" <georglab@uabcvsr2.cvsr.uab.edu> wrote in message
news:NDvpd.109190$Tq1.93977@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
| Quote: | No. It is audiophool nonsense.
"mike" <cabinetmake@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:8Fspd.3998$NU3.2994@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Happy Thanks Giving to All
Do tube dampers really work???
Thanks
Mike M
|
Well, as hip as it is to believe that, it's not.
All tubes are inherently microphonic - ping a first-stage toob with your
finger. Hear something? You bet. The spacing between the elements (as in
grid to cathode, as a biggie) makes each tube a microphone by design. No
matter how well engineered the support structures are.
It was a standard practice to use isolation-mount (usually soft rubber
doughnuts / grommets) sockets on, at least, the high-gain stages. And
covering them with shields, which acted as more than shields - they added
*mass* to the suspended assembly.
Yeah, good engineering practices will minimize the effects of
microphonics. Unfortunately, many new designers forget that those practices
extend to mechanical construction. Isolating the tubes from vibration is
one of them. So. In many cases dampers work (oh, let's say a guitah' combo
amp, as an extreme). Encasing your phono preamp in a 500 pound block of
cement will also work. I'm not saying to run out & buy the overpriced
"audiophool" crap, or discount the fact that some dampers increase the
toob's internal temp. & cause more harm than good, but a tube damper is not
*entirely* snakeoil.
-dim |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mike Gilmour
Guest
|
| Posted:
Mon Nov 29, 2004 6:23 pm Post subject:
Re: Tube Damper???? |
|
|
"Shiva" <helpdesk@666.com> wrote in message
news:jAHqd.3526$%R1.1962@trndny03...
| Quote: |
"JamesG" <georglab@uabcvsr2.cvsr.uab.edu> wrote in message
news:NDvpd.109190$Tq1.93977@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
No. It is audiophool nonsense.
"mike" <cabinetmake@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:8Fspd.3998$NU3.2994@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Happy Thanks Giving to All
Do tube dampers really work???
Thanks
Mike M
Well, as hip as it is to believe that, it's not.
All tubes are inherently microphonic - ping a first-stage toob with your
finger. Hear something? You bet. The spacing between the elements (as
in
grid to cathode, as a biggie) makes each tube a microphone by design. No
matter how well engineered the support structures are.
It was a standard practice to use isolation-mount (usually soft rubber
doughnuts / grommets) sockets on, at least, the high-gain stages. And
covering them with shields, which acted as more than shields - they added
*mass* to the suspended assembly.
Yeah, good engineering practices will minimize the effects of
microphonics. Unfortunately, many new designers forget that those
practices
extend to mechanical construction. Isolating the tubes from vibration is
one of them. So. In many cases dampers work (oh, let's say a guitah'
combo
amp, as an extreme). Encasing your phono preamp in a 500 pound block of
cement will also work. I'm not saying to run out & buy the overpriced
"audiophool" crap, or discount the fact that some dampers increase the
toob's internal temp. & cause more harm than good, but a tube damper is
not
*entirely* snakeoil.
-dim
|
The wisest approach is surely to select a non microphonic tube in the first
place for the first stage (& all stages infact).
One of my tests was through selecting non microphonic tubes and then playing
speakers from another system very loud next to a tubed power amp and
recording the output of that amplifier to DAT. What did I get on playback -
a very low level hiss.. thats all.
Too much is made of tube microphonics in audio...just buy your tubes from a
decent supplier who actually tests them. If you are supplied with a
microphonic tube then simply send it back.
I use coolers that can also damp a microphonic tube a bit... but why not
just change the tube?
Mike |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ian Iveson
Guest
|
| Posted:
Tue Nov 30, 2004 12:23 am Post subject:
Re: Tube Damper???? |
|
|
"Shiva" <helpdesk@666.com> wrote
| Quote: | ...
In many cases dampers work (oh, let's say a guitah' combo
amp, as an extreme). Encasing your phono preamp in a 500 pound
block of
cement will also work. I'm not saying to run out & buy the
overpriced
"audiophool" crap, or discount the fact that some dampers
increase the
toob's internal temp. & cause more harm than good, but a tube
damper is not
*entirely* snakeoil.
|
Depends on the context. If the problem is chassis-born vibration, a
damper on the bottle will probably make matters worse. If air-born,
it will make it better. So you want a block of cement for the
chassis first, then a damper for the toob.
I wonder how much effort is made in valve design to get the
mechanical poles and zeros in the right places?
cheers, Ian |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in