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flipper
Guest
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 Posted:
Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:10 pm Post subject:
Re: THE FOUR DONKEYS OF THE APOCALYPSE ARRIVE Re: Science li |
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On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 08:18:54 GMT, Patrick Turner
<info@turneraudio.com.au> wrote:
| Quote: |
If DDT was so harmless, then we'd be able to drink it for merriment.
No offense but it is simply absurd to suggest that anything not a
'refreshment' should be banned.
But, if you want to 'get involved', and since DDT is already gone from
the scene, maybe you'd like to investigate this one.
http://www.dhmo.org/
They have a lot in common.
Well actually I am a little more concerned about Iranian interest
in trihydrogen oxide.
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Too bad because there's little you can do about Iran but the content
of that web site is an excellent example of logic fallacies and how
they're used with it important to note that every 'fact' in it is
'true' even though the 'message' is not.
Which was it's purpose, btw. as the original paper (don't know for
sure about the web site) was created as a teaching aid on the subject.
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Patrick Turner
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:28 pm Post subject:
Re: THE FOUR DONKEYS OF THE APOCALYPSE ARRIVE Re: Science li |
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Andre Jute wrote:
| Quote: | My dear old Patrick, you have made all my points so well about the
gullibility of those who believe the lies of the Greens, it isn't worth
yet again refuting your waffling point by point with science. I always
thought Flipper wasted his time being so patient with the bloodyminded
fools on the net.
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Well of course Andre, and have you done a poll for who supports/does not support
your ideas on green issues and DDT?
| Quote: |
Andre Jute
Errors and omissions excepted: I haven't read to the end of Patrick's
screed
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You are a busy man on a mission, and so please feel free to ignore
my posts, they are mostly full of plain common sense, which it self must be a terrible
irritation to an intellectual such as yourself because each sentence of CS is usually
seen as a complete travesty against truth, because of what otherwise might be said,
and it must be boring.
But I think this is the wrong group to try to win arguments about DDT, green issues,
and climate change.
I had a rather recalcitrant Pilot amplifier to work on tonight.
Its difficult to teach singing to an amp that otherwise
would be better used for boat anchorage.
But eventually I will get it to work properly, and maybe sing,
and that's something I cannot achieve for the world, no matter
how much I knew about DD fukkin T.
Patrick Turner.
| Quote: |
Patrick Turner wrote:
Andre Jute wrote:
You can drag a donkey to water but you can't make him drink.
Jute qoutes the Journal of American Physicians and Surgeon: "Public
pressure [to ban DDT] was generated by one popular book and sustained
by faulty or fraudulent research. Widely believed claims of
carcinogenicity, toxicity to birds, anti-androgenic properties, and
prolonged environmental persistence are false or grossly exaggerated."
To which Patrick Turner responds:
But I have read much horrible press re DDT, and nobody can convince me to drink
it
I've just told you, reputable authorities say those press reports are
based on "faulty and fraudulent research" and "false and grossly
exaggerated claims". Nobody wants you to drink DDT. We just want you
and the people you support to stop killing Africans by the tens and
hundreds if millions through denying them DDT for control of malaria.
You wishy-washy Green clowns in your nice little suburbs are mass
murderers of poor people. Your hypocrisy stinks like a pile of corpses
after ten days.
I am quite serene about voting green.
Its just one of your life's little unfortunosities that you smell piles of corpses
when I am around to discourse on DDT and Africa.
But I never have ever set out to agree with all the people all the the time.
The ppl I do vote for will provide some balance in the
local parliments, and have no effect whatsover on the situation in Africa,
no efect on DDT use since it was banned year decades ago with no regrets.
You'd be well advised to follow Chris Hornbeck in withdrawing from this
debate, Patrick. You haven't got a foot to stand on. The guilt of the
Greens for this forty-year long genocide is clear beyond the slightest
sliver of doubt.
I suggest that if you are so agrieved about this matter that you form a political
party and stand for parliment so that you can see if you can get your government to put
right
the major injustice against the poor starving Africans.
I don't have time for such persuits, and don't care if i am right or wrong,
I do know DDT is crap i would rather see out of the environment, rather
than in it. The same goes for a bunch of other chemicals, farming methods,
and a long list of other things I could complain about.
Andre Jute
Actions speak louder than words
But where is your action?
Its very easy to shoot me down in flames over DDT because of that
report from the Journal of American Physicians and Surgeon
but I don't necessarily believe all I hear from that source either.
I don't really wish that you would spend one second wasting your time
trying to establish a convincing argument to bring back DDT.
Convincing me would result in zero result on the malaria situation;
If you find that changeing my mind is like dragging a dead donkey, then so be it,
its of little concern to me since my life's time is not at all dominated by the issue,
and my mind isn't worried about whether I am right or wrong.
What you need to do is convince the body of the UN, the US Govt, and
UNDO the legislation against DDT.
While you're at it, perhaps you could get all the other regulations relaxed about
environmental protections etc and just let everyone do exactly what they like.
You'd be amazed how quickly the environment would be quickly
trashed.
Who needs all the clap trap red tape regulatory BS anyway?
Its all a hindrance to progress, eh.
Then we could really surge ahead and save the world.
Just remember to take out some decent life insurance
against falling dead from toxic poisons next time you go
surfing because some "harmelss" junk is a coming outa a pipe from a factory nearby..
Dunno what it is, that stuff, wha we got rid of the ppl who check on all this.
I may well retire frrom the debate because it just plummets to a fool calling session
with no consensus on any truth at the end of the debate.
Debates should lead to better understanding, and I see no sign of it yet occuring on
such an OT
and vexatious issue as the use of DDT.
BTW Andre, try doing a google on DDT.
I got so many hits and I have such a small amount of time to study it all
but a quick look suggests that most ppl think DDT is total crap.
The fact is that there is my opinion, and yours, and everybody elses,
and they don't always agree.
Patrick Turner. |
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Patrick Turner
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:44 pm Post subject:
Re: THE FOUR DONKEYS OF THE APOCALYPSE ARRIVE Re: Science li |
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flipper wrote:
| Quote: | On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 08:18:54 GMT, Patrick Turner
info@turneraudio.com.au> wrote:
If DDT was so harmless, then we'd be able to drink it for merriment.
No offense but it is simply absurd to suggest that anything not a
'refreshment' should be banned.
But, if you want to 'get involved', and since DDT is already gone from
the scene, maybe you'd like to investigate this one.
http://www.dhmo.org/
They have a lot in common.
Well actually I am a little more concerned about Iranian interest
in trihydrogen oxide.
Too bad because there's little you can do about Iran but the content
of that web site is an excellent example of logic fallacies and how
they're used with it important to note that every 'fact' in it is
'true' even though the 'message' is not.
|
There is little I can do about anything, let alone Iran,
who may perhaps just love to let off an atom bomb
in an unknown shipping container after shipping it into NY harbour.
There are a millyun thinks i should be wurried about, but I sleep like a log.
I don't have time to know all there is to know about DDT, apart from
not drinking the shite.
The West would like to impose its rules on the east, but the bombs in Bali
last week tend to say that a fair number of muslims disagree,
and the more we fight them the more they'll fight us.
The problem is that we can't retreat or else the mess would only be a lot
bigger....
I am lucky I am to old to be told where to go and who to fight, and lucky to
be in a peaceful country
that can well afford a few green ideas.
But while millions of words are spouted about terror, and much scheming with
millions of $$
are placed against terror, hardly any effort is made to reduce the road toll
or the industrial accident rate, except to ship industrial jobs to china.
I really only have time to the tubes.
I still like music, its distraction, its escapes, and i refuse to
get overly concerned with a world in which I have virtually no control over.
Patrick Turner
| Quote: |
Which was it's purpose, btw. as the original paper (don't know for
sure about the web site) was created as a teaching aid on the subject.
Patrick Turner.
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flipper
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:53 pm Post subject:
Re: THE FOUR DONKEYS OF THE APOCALYPSE ARRIVE Re: Science li |
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On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 16:44:32 GMT, Patrick Turner
<info@turneraudio.com.au> wrote:
| Quote: |
flipper wrote:
On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 08:18:54 GMT, Patrick Turner
info@turneraudio.com.au> wrote:
If DDT was so harmless, then we'd be able to drink it for merriment.
No offense but it is simply absurd to suggest that anything not a
'refreshment' should be banned.
But, if you want to 'get involved', and since DDT is already gone from
the scene, maybe you'd like to investigate this one.
http://www.dhmo.org/
They have a lot in common.
Well actually I am a little more concerned about Iranian interest
in trihydrogen oxide.
Too bad because there's little you can do about Iran but the content
of that web site is an excellent example of logic fallacies and how
they're used with it important to note that every 'fact' in it is
'true' even though the 'message' is not.
There is little I can do about anything, let alone Iran,
who may perhaps just love to let off an atom bomb
in an unknown shipping container after shipping it into NY harbour.
|
That is why I said it was a shame because the one thing everyone can
do is improve themselves. In this case, one's awareness of logic
fallacies and how they're used to manipulate you.
| Quote: | There are a millyun thinks i should be wurried about, but I sleep like a log.
I don't have time to know all there is to know about DDT, apart from
not drinking the shite.
|
the site, as I explained, is about logic fallacies, not a specific
chemical, but since you brought it up I'd suggest you not drink oven
cleaner either.
Woops. Did I let the cat out of the bag and now it's on the things to
ban list?
| Quote: | The West would like to impose its rules on the east,
|
And what 'rules' would those be? That murdering innocent people is a
bad thing?
| Quote: | but the bombs in Bali
last week tend to say that a fair number of muslims disagree,
and the more we fight them the more they'll fight us.
The problem is that we can't retreat or else the mess would only be a lot
bigger....
|
Exactly.
| Quote: | I am lucky I am to old to be told where to go and who to fight, and lucky to
be in a peaceful country
that can well afford a few green ideas.
|
It is nice to be able to afford things, when they are reasonable and
you pay for it with you own money.
| Quote: | But while millions of words are spouted about terror, and much scheming with
millions of $$
are placed against terror, hardly any effort is made to reduce the road toll
or the industrial accident rate, except to ship industrial jobs to china.
|
Simply not true. There are regulations galore on industry, including
automobiles, safety standards, traffic laws, and police to enforce
them, to name a few. The notion that 'hardly any effort is made' is
rhetorical B.S.
| Quote: | I really only have time to the tubes.
|
That's my next post. I've got some questions now that I have stable
power again and some time to resume work on the amplifier.
| Quote: | I still like music, its distraction, its escapes, and i refuse to
get overly concerned with a world in which I have virtually no control over.
Patrick Turner
Which was it's purpose, btw. as the original paper (don't know for
sure about the web site) was created as a teaching aid on the subject.
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Stewart Pinkerton
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 07, 2005 5:46 am Post subject:
Re: THE FOUR DONKEYS OF THE APOCALYPSE ARRIVE Re: Science li |
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On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 08:18:54 GMT, Patrick Turner
<info@turneraudio.com.au> wrote:
| Quote: |
If DDT was so harmless, then we'd be able to drink it for merriment.
No offense but it is simply absurd to suggest that anything not a
'refreshment' should be banned.
But, if you want to 'get involved', and since DDT is already gone from
the scene, maybe you'd like to investigate this one.
http://www.dhmo.org/
They have a lot in common.
Well actually I am a little more concerned about Iranian interest
in trihydrogen oxide.
|
That's heavy, man..................
--
Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering |
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Ian Iveson
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Oct 09, 2005 11:19 pm Post subject:
Re: THE FOUR DONKEYS OF THE APOCALYPSE ARRIVE Re: Science li |
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"Patrick Turner" wrote
| Quote: | My dear old Patrick, you have made all my points so well about
the
gullibility of those who believe the lies of the Greens, it isn't
worth
yet again refuting your waffling point by point with science. I
always
thought Flipper wasted his time being so patient with the
bloodyminded
fools on the net.
Well of course Andre, and have you done a poll for who
supports/does not support
your ideas on green issues and DDT?
|
http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Andre+Jute&word2=Patrick+Turner
Ian |
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