| Author |
Message |
Gary Eickmeier
Guest
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 Posted:
Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:19 pm Post subject:
Video Compression |
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I have tried to reduce the file size of a 12 minute video by using some
codecs in my Matrox/Premiere system. I can't get any sort of reasonable
quality until I get up to about a 60 meg file size. Is that what I
should expect, or are there better codecs available that can compress it
better, and to smaller sizes? What do people normally use to put
something on a web site? I'm leaning toward Windows Media, because that
seems to be the most available. Smaller screen sizes are fine - just
want to see them with good quality pic and sound.
Thanks,
Gary Eickmeier
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Smarty
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:41 pm Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Gary,
Try Windows Media Encoder. It makes very small file sizes with excellent
video and sound considering the compression. It has templates for many
common / popular formats, and can also be customized.
Smarty
"Gary Eickmeier" <geickmei@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:7gdZe.100887$xl6.5663@tornado.tampabay.rr.com...
| Quote: | I have tried to reduce the file size of a 12 minute video by using some
codecs in my Matrox/Premiere system. I can't get any sort of reasonable
quality until I get up to about a 60 meg file size. Is that what I should
expect, or are there better codecs available that can compress it better,
and to smaller sizes? What do people normally use to put something on a web
site? I'm leaning toward Windows Media, because that seems to be the most
available. Smaller screen sizes are fine - just want to see them with good
quality pic and sound.
Thanks,
Gary Eickmeier |
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Jukka Aho
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:09 pm Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Gary Eickmeier wrote:
| Quote: | I can't get any sort of reasonable quality until I get up to about a
60 meg file size. Is that what I should expect, or are there better
codecs available that can compress it
better, and to smaller sizes? What do people normally use to put
something on a web site?
|
Windows Media is probably the most readily-accessible modern web format
for video, simply because it is supported out-of-the-box on the Windows
platform. QuickTime MPEG-4 and Real Media are the the two other commonly
seen options, (although I don't personally like Real's intrusive
half-spyware player, and rather tend to install "Real Alternative".)
XviD/DivX + MP3 / ogg vorbis soundtrack is yet another option. I don't
think there are currently others worth mentioning.
--
znark |
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Gary Eickmeier
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:11 pm Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Smarty wrote:
| Quote: | Gary,
Try Windows Media Encoder. It makes very small file sizes with excellent
video and sound considering the compression. It has templates for many
common / popular formats, and can also be customized.
|
Yes, as I mentioned, I have been trying Windows Media, but I have to get
it to 60 meg before I get good quality (12 minute video). Is that normal
or what? How big can it be to go on a web site?
Thanks,
Gary Eickmeier |
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Smarty
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 12:41 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Gary,
My personal experience with wmv is that a range of 10 megaBytes per minute
at the high end and maybe 2 or 3 megabytes per minute at the low end
represents the range of quality I would consider acceptable for web and
casual TV viewing. This would require, therefore, file sizes in the 120
megabyte to 24 megabyte range for your 12 minute movie. I have made files
one tenth the size to carry full length movies on my Pocket PC, and thus
have fit 2 hr long movies into 100 megabyte files as well using wmv, but the
quality is barely acceptable.
The issue I think is mostly what you consider "good quality" since Windows
Media Encoder can make your 12 minute movie into a 10 or 12 megabyte file if
you are willing to sacrifice high speed motion, full bandwidth stereo sound,
etc. I send email movies to family using this approach and people are
delighted with the results, but I also demand over 3 Megabytes per SECOND
(approx 200 megabytes per minute) for the HDV hi def video I edit and
watch, and everything else looks like "low quality"!
My point is.........either you choose the file size you accept and let
Windows make the best movie it can to fit it, or choose the least level of
quality you will accept and let the file size be what it may.
None of the compressors have any better efficiency / quality per megabyte
compared to wmv format at the lower end of the performance range, and even
at the higher end the wmvHD format is pretty amazing, all considered.
QuickTime with a Mac can do similar very good mpeg4 / H.264 movies also if
you have such hardware and software.
Smarty
"Gary Eickmeier" <geickmei@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:aNfZe.127728$p_1.104849@tornado.tampabay.rr.com...
| Quote: |
Smarty wrote:
Gary,
Try Windows Media Encoder. It makes very small file sizes with excellent
video and sound considering the compression. It has templates for many
common / popular formats, and can also be customized.
Yes, as I mentioned, I have been trying Windows Media, but I have to get
it to 60 meg before I get good quality (12 minute video). Is that normal
or what? How big can it be to go on a web site?
Thanks,
Gary Eickmeier |
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Specs
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 1:01 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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"Gary Eickmeier" <geickmei@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:aNfZe.127728$p_1.104849@tornado.tampabay.rr.com...
| Quote: |
Smarty wrote:
Gary,
Try Windows Media Encoder. It makes very small file sizes with excellent
video and sound considering the compression. It has templates for many
common / popular formats, and can also be customized.
Yes, as I mentioned, I have been trying Windows Media, but I have to get
it to 60 meg before I get good quality (12 minute video). Is that normal
or what? How big can it be to go on a web site?
Thanks,
Gary Eickmeier
|
Gary
What size (pixel dimensions) is the target file? If the file is for web
delivery then you should concentrate on the bit-rate e.g. 300kbs for a
standard 512kbps broadband connection if you want it to stream. Reduce the
dimensions of the output file to get the quality you desire. I generally
use standard output sizes such as QCIF and CIF and alter the bitrate to suit
narrow band and broad band users for streaming.
If I want the users to download a full size video I'll use the most
efficient codec possible and the size of the file is what it is. Quality vs
compression vs file size.....
60 meg isn't that bad for broadband users btw. |
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Richard Crowley
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 1:02 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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"Gary Eickmeier" wrote ...
| Quote: | Yes, as I mentioned, I have been trying Windows Media,
but I have to get it to 60 meg before I get good quality (12
minute video). Is that normal or what? How big can it be
to go on a web site?
|
WMV has been the best-performing and widest-available
codec for web distribution that I have found. How does
your notion of "good quality" compare to similar video on
the web?
60MB may be OK for people on broadband, but the majority
of users are still stuck with dialup. Few of us on dialup would
attempt to view/download a 60MB file unless we were REALLY
motivated.
Are you sure you can't live with lower quality (maybe 15FPS
or something)? Hard to offer opinions when we don't know the
content. What about breaking it into more managable pieces?
I just went and cheked a page of WMV videos I maintain and
they average 5-7MB per minute at a quality level that is really
higher than it needs to be. When we need to put more videos
up online, I will likely re-encode them for lower bitrate (i.e.
smaller size)
http://www.professionallyspeaking.org/archive.html |
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Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 2:23 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Currently,
I stream everything on my site with .wmv using the Windows Media
Encoder and .mov using Quicktime, but I have moved away from .them
lately while working on my clients sites.
The Macromedia Flash player now supports .flv (Flash Video) files. I've
found a couple really cool pros:
1) The video looks great and much smaller file size!
2) EVERYONE has the flash player. It is now the most universal of all
players. Windows, MAC, Linux/UNIX all view the video the way I encoded
it.
There are a couple of .flv converters out there for free. I've found a
great one called Riva FLV Encoder.
Mookie
Killing Time Productions
http://www.killingtimeproductions.com/ |
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Gary Eickmeier
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 4:41 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Richard Crowley wrote:
| Quote: | "Gary Eickmeier" wrote ...
Yes, as I mentioned, I have been trying Windows Media, but I have to
get it to 60 meg before I get good quality (12 minute video). Is that
normal or what? How big can it be to go on a web site?
WMV has been the best-performing and widest-available
codec for web distribution that I have found. How does your notion of
"good quality" compare to similar video on
the web?
60MB may be OK for people on broadband, but the majority
of users are still stuck with dialup. Few of us on dialup would
attempt to view/download a 60MB file unless we were REALLY
motivated.
Are you sure you can't live with lower quality (maybe 15FPS
or something)? Hard to offer opinions when we don't know the content.
What about breaking it into more managable pieces?
I just went and cheked a page of WMV videos I maintain and
they average 5-7MB per minute at a quality level that is really
higher than it needs to be. When we need to put more videos
up online, I will likely re-encode them for lower bitrate (i.e.
smaller size)
http://www.professionallyspeaking.org/archive.html
|
Thanks everyone for your extensive replies. Richard, I checked out a few
of your videos on the link above, and they are great. Larger screen size
than I am getting, and took no time to download. I tried to E-mail one
of mine, I think the 30 meg one, and I gave up after a few minutes
because I didn't want to put the recipient through all that download
time. So how do you get your 180 meg files up and running so fast on
your web site?
Thanks,
Gary Eickmeier |
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Smarty
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 4:41 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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What is the "much smaller file size" achieved by Flash .flv files, and what
tool / encoder can be used to make .flv files for experimentation? I'm
personally curious to see how the video looks, how the sound is, and how
fast the encoder is.
Many thanks.
Smarty
"Richard Crowley" <rcrowley@xpr7t.net> wrote in message
news:11jbp69f3tug353@corp.supernews.com...
| Quote: | mrmook wrote...
I stream everything on my site with .wmv using the Windows Media
Encoder and .mov using Quicktime, but I have moved away from .them
lately while working on my clients sites.
The Macromedia Flash player now supports .flv (Flash Video) files. I've
found a couple really cool pros:
1) The video looks great and much smaller file size!
2) EVERYONE has the flash player. It is now the most universal of all
players. Windows, MAC, Linux/UNIX all view the video the way I encoded
it.
There are a couple of .flv converters out there for free. I've found a
great one called Riva FLV Encoder.
I have also heard some good things about that format.
Thanks for the reference. I was intending to experiment
with it, but couldn't justify the cost of the software yet. |
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Richard Crowley
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 4:41 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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mrmook wrote...
| Quote: | I stream everything on my site with .wmv using the Windows Media
Encoder and .mov using Quicktime, but I have moved away from .them
lately while working on my clients sites.
The Macromedia Flash player now supports .flv (Flash Video) files.
I've
found a couple really cool pros:
1) The video looks great and much smaller file size!
2) EVERYONE has the flash player. It is now the most universal of all
players. Windows, MAC, Linux/UNIX all view the video the way I encoded
it.
There are a couple of .flv converters out there for free. I've found a
great one called Riva FLV Encoder.
|
I have also heard some good things about that format.
Thanks for the reference. I was intending to experiment
with it, but couldn't justify the cost of the software yet. |
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Richard Crowley
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:20 am Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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"Gary Eickmeier" wrote ...
| Quote: | Thanks everyone for your extensive replies. Richard, I checked out a
few of your videos on the link above, and they are great. Larger
screen size than I am getting, and took no time to download. I tried
to E-mail one of mine, I think the 30 meg one, and I gave up after a
few minutes because I didn't want to put the recipient through all
that download time. So how do you get your 180 meg files up and
running so fast on your web site?
|
I FTP upload them from the office (where we have 10MB internet
connections :-) They don't open that fast for me here at home on
dialup. |
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Gary Eickmeier
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:15 pm Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Richard Crowley wrote:
| Quote: | "Gary Eickmeier" wrote ...
Thanks everyone for your extensive replies. Richard, I checked out a
few of your videos on the link above, and they are great. Larger
screen size than I am getting, and took no time to download. I tried
to E-mail one of mine, I think the 30 meg one, and I gave up after a
few minutes because I didn't want to put the recipient through all
that download time. So how do you get your 180 meg files up and
running so fast on your web site?
I FTP upload them from the office (where we have 10MB internet
connections :-) They don't open that fast for me here at home on
dialup.
|
Thanks. But it really surprises me that you, a video guy, are on dial-up
even at home. You live on a mountain top or somethin...?
Gary Eickmeier |
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Richard Crowley
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 9:05 pm Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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"Gary Eickmeier" wrote ...
| Quote: | Thanks. But it really surprises me that you, a video guy, are
on dial-up even at home. You live on a mountain top or somethin...?
|
What can I say? I live in a low-speed telecommunications ghetto.
There was no internet back when I bought this place, and it never
occured to me that being >> 18,000 ft from the telco CO was going
to be a problem. And I've heard so many horror stories about the
cable operation, I'm not even curious enough to see whether they
offer data service on my street. Ironically, I work at one of the
most high-tech companies on the planet. |
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Gary Eickmeier
Guest
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| Posted:
Sun Sep 25, 2005 10:30 pm Post subject:
Re: Video Compression |
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Richard Crowley wrote:
| Quote: | "Gary Eickmeier" wrote ...
Thanks. But it really surprises me that you, a video guy, are
on dial-up even at home. You live on a mountain top or somethin...?
What can I say? I live in a low-speed telecommunications ghetto.
There was no internet back when I bought this place, and it never
occured to me that being >> 18,000 ft from the telco CO was going
to be a problem. And I've heard so many horror stories about the
cable operation, I'm not even curious enough to see whether they
offer data service on my street. Ironically, I work at one of the
most high-tech companies on the planet.
|
So doesn't DSL work off the phone lines?
Gary Eickmeier |
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