| Author |
Message |
RS
Guest
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 Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 8:38 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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I think you can get some effects like this by putting a nylon stocking over
the lens. The sheerness of the material will determine the blur.
"G Hardy" <gareth.hardy1@ntlwrold.com> wrote in message
news:zlqgd.59$2l3.52@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
| Quote: | If you hadn't I was ready to suggest adding Vaseline to the lens, LOL
I forget where I saw it, but I recall a DVD with a "making of" feature
where
the director suggests using Vaseline on the lens to hide wires or
something.
I can see it as a legitimate technique for getting that absurdly soft
focus
and flare that K-Tel use when advertising '70s hippy music compilations.
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david.mccall
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 8:50 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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"RS" <idontthinkso@mail.com> wrote in message
news:418270d7$1_2@newspeer2.tds.net...
| Quote: | I think you can get some effects like this by putting a nylon stocking over
the lens. The sheerness of the material will determine the blur.
These are substantially different looks. |
Stockings mostly provide diffusion, which reduces the contrast
more than blurring out the image. The result is a "softer" image
rather than a blurring of the image.
Vaseline is more of a blurry effect. It is often used to create a vignette
sort of effect by leaving the center fairly clear and the edges fairly
thick.
As another person mentioned, you don't put anything on the lens itself,
you put it on a filter, knowing that you may never be able to get it truly
clean ever again.
David |
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a-e-i-o-u-
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 9:02 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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Oh.. sure.. It was a common technique to hide wrinkles for female stars in
features made up into the 60's .Which makes me wonder why there isn't a
vaseline filter. There's everything else.
"G Hardy" <gareth.hardy1@ntlwrold.com> wrote in message
news:zlqgd.59$2l3.52@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
| Quote: | If you hadn't I was ready to suggest adding Vaseline to the lens, LOL
I forget where I saw it, but I recall a DVD with a "making of" feature
where
the director suggests using Vaseline on the lens to hide wires or
something.
I can see it as a legitimate technique for getting that absurdly soft
focus
and flare that K-Tel use when advertising '70s hippy music compilations.
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Guy
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 9:09 pm Post subject:
Re: 3-chip HDV footage available |
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Which clip/s are you talking about?
The clips were recorded by a well meaning novice who has had the camera only
a short time and is learning on the job so to speak. All credit to him that
we can see native footage from the camera.
The wavy lines could be interlacing artefacts caused by your player perhaps?
There is motion blur on the clips but it does look natural and we have no
idea how the camera was setup. The only compression artefacts I have
noticed have been on clips that have since been deleted which had blocky
areas in the murky blacks. I did have the brightness up on my monitor to
notice them.
G
"Richard Cavell" <richardcavell@mail.com> wrote in message
news:418258ab$0$21875$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...
| Quote: | On 28/10/04 1:33 PM, Mike Kujbida wrote:
Samples of footage from the new Sony 3-chip Sony HDR-FX1 HDV camera have
been posted at http://www.hdvinfo.net/media/kakugyo/
Could I just ask - there's a fair bit of artefact there - some motion
blur and wavy vertical lines going on. Is that a compression artefact
or the camera or what? |
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a-e-i-o-u-
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 9:40 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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YES! A glass plate in the filter holder.
"MSu1049321" <msu1049321@aol.comnospamn> wrote in message
news:20041029092740.16506.00001819@mb-m27.aol.com...
| Quote: | BTW, to be technically accurate about this, you NEVER put vaseline on the
lens
itself, you put it on a clear filter *over* the lens.
One that you will be throwing away after the shoot. |
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Seattle Eric
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:20 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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<eye roll> Or you use one of the many common "mist" filters
commercially available.
Amateurs.
a-e-i-o-u- wrote:
| Quote: | YES! A glass plate in the filter holder.
"MSu1049321" <msu1049321@aol.comnospamn> wrote in message
news:20041029092740.16506.00001819@mb-m27.aol.com...
BTW, to be technically accurate about this, you NEVER put vaseline on the
lens
itself, you put it on a clear filter *over* the lens.
One that you will be throwing away after the shoot.
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a-e-i-o-u-
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:26 pm Post subject:
Re: A good compositor? |
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AE does have a particle system. It is bare bones but you can generate great
fx with it. Combustion has libraries of fx which are canned and simply
awesome.
"Richard Cavell" <richardcavell@mail.com> wrote in message
news:417a7fb3$0$21871$61ce578d@news.syd.swiftdsl.com.au...
| Quote: | On 24/10/04 1:36 AM, MSu1049321 wrote:
Apple motion. Shake. AfterEffects. Commotion. Boris.
After effects doesn't appear to have any particle effects as standard.
Shake's too expensive. What would you use?
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a-e-i-o-u-
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 11:26 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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I was referring to the methods used with film cameras.. which don't include
a mist filter for video cameras. .
I like your sig though. Seems appropriate.
"Seattle Eric" <noone@erehwon.gov> wrote in message
news:418289d8$0$11701$8b463f8a@news.nationwide.net...
| Quote: | eye roll> Or you use one of the many common "mist" filters commercially
available.
Amateurs. |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Oct 29, 2004 11:40 pm Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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In message <SIugd.15116$6q2.1805@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>, a-e-i-o-u-
<joseft@sbcglobal.net> writes
| Quote: | Oh.. sure.. It was a common technique to hide wrinkles for female stars
in features made up into the 60's .
|
An urban myth. Soft focus portrait lenses have been available since the
20's on large-format and medium-format cameras. In later 35mm SLR days
there were lenses available for that camera format. And soft-focus
lenses are vaseline-free :-)
Using a soft focus lens is not the same as using a diffusion filter on a
conventional lens, nor is it the same as stopping down a conventional
lens. A diffusion filter causes a random scattering of the rays at all
points across the aperture. The image obtained with a soft-focus lens
retains all of the subject detail over a wider depth of field than with
a conventional lens set to the same aperture, but the emphasis is on the
fine detail or the bolder elements.
All the medium-format camera manufacturers offered one or more
soft-focus lenses, but none offered a jar of vaseline :-)
An example of medium format SF is the Mamiya Telephoto 150mm f/4 Soft
Focus Lens for RB67 Cameras.
A 35mm examples are the Canon FD 85mm f/2.8 and 135mm F2.8 Soft Focus
Lens. Cheaper options were the Spiratone Portragon or Sima Soft Focus
(T-mount).
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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a-e-i-o-u-
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:40 am Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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"Tony Morgan" <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> wrote in message
news:HrfGdvCKzpgBFwMN@zen54488.dircon.co.uk...
| Quote: | In message <SIugd.15116$6q2.1805@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>, a-e-i-o-u-
joseft@sbcglobal.net> writes
Oh.. sure.. It was a common technique to hide wrinkles for female stars in
features made up into the 60's .
An urban myth. Soft focus portrait lenses have been available since the
20's on large-format and medium-format cameras. In later 35mm SLR days
there were lenses available for that camera format. And soft-focus lenses
are vaseline-free :-)
|
Not a myth at all. Vaseline was commonly used. I recall a get-together with
the older guys from the ASC, the ones who actually SHOT the stuff, while
working at a visual effects house in Los Angeles in the 80's. We had a short
discussion about it and indeed it was certainly one of the techniques used.
We're not talking SLRs here.. Panavision Lenses, Mitchell cameras, 65mm
cameras.. |
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david.mccall
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:53 am Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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"a-e-i-o-u-" <josef4t4@4sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:1Vxgd.2243$zx1.1609@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
| Quote: |
Not a myth at all. Vaseline was commonly used. I recall a get-together
with the older guys from the ASC, the ones who actually SHOT the stuff,
while working at a visual effects house in Los Angeles in the 80's. We had
a short discussion about it and indeed it was certainly one of the
techniques used. We're not talking SLRs here.. Panavision Lenses, Mitchell
cameras, 65mm cameras..
65, huh? that's almost surprising. |
There are a wide variety of over the counter diffusion and distortion
effects,
but they aren't quite the same thing as a hand made effect (like Vaseline on
the lens). Now that's the good news and the bad news. The over the counter
filters are much more consistent than anything you are likely to accomplish,
but that can be a good thing. If you need a vignette effect where it is only
a little diffused on the part of the image while going fuzzy around the
edges.
You can buy various filters and combine them in a matte box. You don't have
as much control over the shape and density, but your fingers don't get all
gooey.
David |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:07 am Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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In message <1Vxgd.2243$zx1.1609@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>, a-e-i-o-u-
<josef4t4@4sbcglobal.net> writes
| Quote: | Not a myth at all. Vaseline was commonly used.
|
Just think about it. Do you think that the camera manufacturers would
even think about developing/manufacturing/selling soft-focus lenses when
all that was required was a jar of vaseline?
Do you REALLY believe this when all the MF camera manufacturers
(Hassslebad, Mimaya and Bronica for example) sold SF lenses (sometimes
called "Portrait Lenses")?
| Quote: | I recall a get-together with the older guys from the ASC, the ones who
actually SHOT the stuff
|
Couldn't they afford proper lenses? Anyone CAN smear their lens (or
filter) with vaseline, but professionals would have the right tools for
the job.
And if your "older guys" looked at the "vaseline" results, comparing
with a proper SF photograph, - they SHOULD be able to spot the
difference, unless their eyes have gone dim :-).
Soft focus lenses retain the detail, while vaseline-encrusted lenses do
not.
That is why (in video) you can (as someone here pointed out) emulate
*real* soft-focus well by adding a second layer with diffusion (and
with a degree of transparency), and the detail in the lower layer
"shines through" - as exhibited on still photographs that use soft-focus
lenses.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:20 am Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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In message <rYX9RBHpErgBFwKX@zen54488.dircon.co.uk>, Tony Morgan
<tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> writes
| Quote: | In message <1Vxgd.2243$zx1.1609@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>, a-e-i-o-u-
josef4t4@4sbcglobal.net> writes
Not a myth at all. Vaseline was commonly used.
Just think about it. Do you think that the camera manufacturers would
even think about developing/manufacturing/selling soft-focus lenses
when all that was required was a jar of vaseline?
|
Snipped...
Sorry to follow-up on my own post, but a quick Google threw up some
still-image examples of the soft-focus options at:
http://www.escrappers.com/softfocus.html
Though this is specifically for PhotoShop, everything there is exactly
as with a video editor which gives the FX options.
The significant thing, though, is that you can see the difference in
detail between diffusion (aka vaseline on the lens) and on the layering
technique where detail is retained.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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a-e-i-o-u-
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:23 am Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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"Tony Morgan" <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> wrote in message
news:rYX9RBHpErgBFwKX@zen54488.dircon.co.uk...
| Quote: | In message <1Vxgd.2243$zx1.1609@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>, a-e-i-o-u-
josef4t4@4sbcglobal.net> writes
Not a myth at all. Vaseline was commonly used.
Just think about it. Do you think that the camera manufacturers would even
think about developing/manufacturing/selling soft-focus lenses when all
that was required was a jar of vaseline?
|
Tony, I know this went right past you but the ASC is the American Society of
Cinematographers. These are the people who actually SHOT the movies I am
referring to.
I do not recall ANY of them mentioning soft focus lenses. In fact, aside
from 35mm SLR lenses I don't even know if there is one in the Panavision
rental list.
I think we are talking about two differnt things here. I am talking about
movies made from 1930 - 1970 and you are talking about Hasslebad, Mamiya,
and Bronica, none of which make lenses for motion picture cameras of the
type used on Panavision, Mitchell , Arri etc.
That's all on this subject. I think you shoudl do a little google searching
or just look at film history. Not 35SLR or videography though as it is not
relevant to my point.
| Quote: | Do you REALLY believe this when all the MF camera manufacturers
(Hassslebad, Mimaya and Bronica for example) sold SF lenses (sometimes
called "Portrait Lenses")?
I recall a get-together with the older guys from the ASC, the ones who
actually SHOT the stuff
Couldn't they afford proper lenses? Anyone CAN smear their lens (or
filter) with vaseline, but professionals would have the right tools for
the job.
And if your "older guys" looked at the "vaseline" results, comparing with
a proper SF photograph, - they SHOULD be able to spot the difference,
unless their eyes have gone dim :-).
Soft focus lenses retain the detail, while vaseline-encrusted lenses do
not.
That is why (in video) you can (as someone here pointed out) emulate
*real* soft-focus well by adding a second layer with diffusion (and with
a degree of transparency), and the detail in the lower layer "shines
through" - as exhibited on still photographs that use soft-focus lenses.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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AnthonyR
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Oct 30, 2004 2:25 am Post subject:
Re: Vaseline Effect with Premiere Pro |
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"Tony Morgan" <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> wrote in message
news:x447p6HXQrgBFwKP@zen54488.dircon.co.uk...
| Quote: | In message <rYX9RBHpErgBFwKX@zen54488.dircon.co.uk>, Tony Morgan
tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> writes
In message <1Vxgd.2243$zx1.1609@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>, a-e-i-o-u-
josef4t4@4sbcglobal.net> writes
Not a myth at all. Vaseline was commonly used.
Just think about it. Do you think that the camera manufacturers would even
think about developing/manufacturing/selling soft-focus lenses when all
that was required was a jar of vaseline?
Snipped...
Sorry to follow-up on my own post, but a quick Google threw up some
still-image examples of the soft-focus options at:
http://www.escrappers.com/softfocus.html
Though this is specifically for PhotoShop, everything there is exactly as
with a video editor which gives the FX options.
The significant thing, though, is that you can see the difference in
detail between diffusion (aka vaseline on the lens) and on the layering
technique where detail is retained.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info
|
Tony,
Cool web link, thanks..
option 1, the use of a simple Gaussian blur on a second layer looks the best
of them all in my opinion.
Neat trick to use in Post and no lens filter needed.
:)
AnthonyR. |
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