| Author |
Message |
Tony Morgan
Guest
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 Posted:
Wed Oct 27, 2004 11:58 pm Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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In message <2ua3t7F28nu5kU1@uni-berlin.de>, J.O. Aho <user@example.net>
writes
Snipped before and after....
| Quote: | IMHO *nix is wonderfull for the administrators, as they can do so much
more than just decide who gets a login and who is allowed to install
software.
|
You can do that in all Wins from 2K onwards. On my machines, for
example, my grandchildren have their own accounts for when they come to
visit. They aren't allowed to access *anything* that I choose them not
to. And their Internet access (via my router/broadband) is subject to
net-nanny software. They can send/receive e-mails, but can't see mine.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info
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Ivan Marsh
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:02 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 20:46:41 +0100, Tony Morgan wrote:
| Quote: | In message <2u9uehF28m18uU1@uni-berlin.de>, Ian Molton <spyro@f2s.com
writes
SjT wrote:
I'm with stupid ---> Ian Molton <spyro@f2s.com> wrote:
Snipped....
I'm not going to reply point by point (most of which I'd agree with -
with reservations).
But I would (if you will forgive me) reminisce about the times when
software (at all levels and flavours) was extensively apha-tested, and
then through "special arrangements" with (often established) customers,
extensively beta-tested before full release.
These days due to pressure from the bean-counters, products are rushed
into production/distribution, warts and all. This is because development
costs are so high with increasingly complex applications and financial
returns must be found to keep things afloat
Bugs are fixed when reported, and the hapless customer-base has to keep
an eye open on the support web-page to ensure that he/she keeps up with
incremental bug-fixing versions.
And then (surprise, surprise) just when everyone is cooling down with a
stable and bug-free product, the manufacturer issues a new version that
requires the customer to fork out some more money to upgrade. Then the
cycle repeats, and repeats, and repeats - ad infinitum.
Way of the world, I'm afraid :-(
|
This paradigm shift took place during the Microsoft Access / Borland
Paradox for Windows battle of the late 80's early 90's when "First to
Market" became the only concern. The software business was never the same.
Microsoft "won" by releasing a product that barely worked... we all lost.
--
i.m.
The USA Patriot Act is the most unpatriotic act in American history. |
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Daniel Kelly (AKA Jack)
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:03 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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No, DreamWorks, Industrial Light and Magic and Pixar are all massive
animation studios who are very very very very very successfull businesses.
They all use, modify and contribute to Linux.
"Tony Morgan" <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> wrote in message
news:WcCyAYFAf$fBFwVJ@zen54488.dircon.co.uk...
| Quote: | In message <clokdr$igm$1@uns-a.ucl.ac.uk>, "Daniel Kelly (AKA Jack)"
d.kellyNOSPAM@NOSPAM.ucl.ac.uk> writes
Hmm...that approach seemed to work for DreamWorks, ILM and Pixar!
I'm not familiar with those products.
Are they Linux apps? And are they competing with similar products in a
large marketplace that is dominated by (functionally similar)
established products?
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:53 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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|
In message <pan.2004.10.27.19.54.31.687184@you.now>, Ivan Marsh
<annoyed@you.now> writes
Premiere Pro.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Bill Unruh
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:18 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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]Daniel Kelly (AKA Jack) wrote:
]>
]> I know that Linux can be a pain to administer. In fact it's pretty damn ugly
]> in places.
Lets see you do not use Linux, but repeat 5 times that Linux is hard to
administer. You have an opinion on the nature of dark matter too I assume. |
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Bill Unruh
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:27 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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Tony Morgan <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> writes:
]In message <clokdr$igm$1@uns-a.ucl.ac.uk>, "Daniel Kelly (AKA Jack)"
]<d.kellyNOSPAM@NOSPAM.ucl.ac.uk> writes
]>Hmm...that approach seemed to work for DreamWorks, ILM and Pixar!
]I'm not familiar with those products.
]Are they Linux apps? And are they competing with similar products in a
]large marketplace that is dominated by (functionally similar)
]established products?
???? Sheesh. YOu have heard of the United States?
Those are the three largest companies in computer animation/special
effects. They are huge companies. One or the other has been involved in
every film you have seen in the past 10 years. |
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Ian Molton
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:39 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
|
|
Tony Morgan wrote:
| Quote: | I keep on trying to put the fundamental issue across. It's return on
investment (ROI).
|
Yeah, we got that. stop repeating a TLA ok?
| Quote: | Insofar as Claranet (since you've brought it up), I've just looked at
their product range (in view of their "extensive use of OSS"), and I see
that they do offer four small non-scalable solutions based on three
alternative IBM X-Series machines or on Cobalt RaQ technology,
|
Whhuuu? Who said thats all they do? I was an internal developer working
on their ISP services. My work was related to mail processing and SMS
and fax delivery, as well as some internal C based CGI. I wrote an SMTP
server from scratch during that time, and adapted a number of OSS
programs to work with it and the fax and SMS gateways (the SMS gateway
was also in large part written from scratch by me, and in fact passed BT
certification first time).
Clearly you have no clue what else claranet use OSS for.
| Quote: | I hope I'm wrong - but in the commercial world of today, I doubt that I
am. And if I were wrong I'm sure someone would already be there and
banging on everyone's door.
All just my opinion of course :-)
|
The other point is, of course, that:
a) if no-one does it it'll never happen
b) the first person to deliver a REALLY good thing will be onto a winner. |
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Robert Billing
Guest
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| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:39 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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|
Among the wreckage we found a fragment on which Tony Morgan had scratched:
| Quote: | In message <2u9f8mF27i046U1@uni-berlin.de>, Ian Molton <spyro@f2s.com
writes
Snipped....
besides - if you HAVE the source, you arent forced to wait - if you
really want something, you can write it yourself, or pay someone else
to - no waiting required.
True Ian, but if you run a business on that basis you'll soon be
out-of-business.
|
Interesting. I run a business that writes or fixes things on that basis
for those who want to pay to have them written or fixed. |
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Ian Molton
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:43 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
|
|
Tony Morgan wrote:
| Quote: | In message <2ua3t7F28nu5kU1@uni-berlin.de>, J.O. Aho <user@example.net
writes
Snipped before and after....
IMHO *nix is wonderfull for the administrators, as they can do so much
more than just decide who gets a login and who is allowed to install
software.
You can do that in all Wins from 2K onwards. On my machines, for
example, my grandchildren have their own accounts for when they come to
visit. They aren't allowed to access *anything* that I choose them not
to. And their Internet access (via my router/broadband) is subject to
net-nanny software. They can send/receive e-mails, but can't see mine.
|
Trouble with windows access controls is they are so damn complicated. I
guess thats what you get with hierarchical, inherited ACL based systems.
on unix, you have owner, group, all, read, write and execute. thats
*IT*. its simple, easy, and fits 99% of all uses without difficulty. the
other 1% it can handle but your /etc/groups file may grow a bit... |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:30 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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|
In message <2uamcaF27qo9pU1@uni-berlin.de>, Ian Molton <spyro@f2s.com>
writes
Snipped.... and below.
| Quote: | Clearly you have no clue what else claranet use OSS for.
|
And you are clueless not to see (in the context of this thread) that
we're talking about the development and commercial viability of
solutions - not Internet connectivity. I had looked at their business
profile after I read your post, so I *am* aware of their other markets.
Though I did think it might be otherwise, you now seem to be like a lot
of tekkies - clueless about business issues.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:39 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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|
In message <pan.2004.10.27.19.54.31.687184@you.now>, Ivan Marsh
<annoyed@you.now> writes
Having now had time to have a quick look through their manual, ISTM that
the product can't be equated with Premiere or Vegas. It appears to be
more an entry-level NLE on a par with WMM2, EditStudio or Pinnacle 9.
Just to confirm, I'll download their Win port (which they say provides
the same functionality) to see just how far it does go towards
Premiere/Vegas.
Having said that, It's no doubt more than adequate for home video
editing.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:41 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
|
|
In message <clp7cf$hal$1@nntp.itservices.ubc.ca>, Bill Unruh
<unruh@string.physics.ubc.ca> writes
| Quote: | Tony Morgan <tonymorgan@xtreme.pipex.net> writes:
]In message <clokdr$igm$1@uns-a.ucl.ac.uk>, "Daniel Kelly (AKA Jack)"
]<d.kellyNOSPAM@NOSPAM.ucl.ac.uk> writes
]>Hmm...that approach seemed to work for DreamWorks, ILM and Pixar!
]I'm not familiar with those products.
]Are they Linux apps? And are they competing with similar products in a
]large marketplace that is dominated by (functionally similar)
]established products?
???? Sheesh. YOu have heard of the United States?
Those are the three largest companies in computer animation/special
effects. They are huge companies. One or the other has been involved in
every film you have seen in the past 10 years.
So you're saying they're NLEs on a par with Premiere/Vegas/Avid? From |
what I can see now I've looked they seem to be FX products.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Tony Morgan
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:47 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
|
|
In message <pan.2004.10.27.22.39.42.303560@tnglwood.demon.co.uk>, Robert
Billing <unclebob@tnglwood.demon.co.uk> writes
| Quote: | Among the wreckage we found a fragment on which Tony Morgan had scratched:
In message <2u9f8mF27i046U1@uni-berlin.de>, Ian Molton <spyro@f2s.com
writes
Snipped....
besides - if you HAVE the source, you arent forced to wait - if you
really want something, you can write it yourself, or pay someone else
to - no waiting required.
True Ian, but if you run a business on that basis you'll soon be
out-of-business.
Interesting. I run a business that writes or fixes things on that basis
for those who want to pay to have them written or fixed.
Let's try to put it in a context that you might understand. If you, in |
your business required to spend (say) £50K on a bit of kit, wouldn't you
expect that possession of that bit of kit to generate at least £50's
worth of additional business?
Similarly, if you were in the business of producing widgets, if it cost
you (say) £50K to design the product and set up the tooling, would you
expect to be able to generated at least £50K's worth of sales in the
first six months of production?
Not exactly rocket-science :-)
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info |
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Ian Molton
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 4:32 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
|
|
Tony Morgan wrote:
| Quote: | In message <2uamcaF27qo9pU1@uni-berlin.de>, Ian Molton <spyro@f2s.com
writes
Snipped.... and below.
Clearly you have no clue what else claranet use OSS for.
And you are clueless not to see (in the context of this thread) that
we're talking about the development and commercial viability of
solutions - not Internet connectivity. I had looked at their business
profile after I read your post, so I *am* aware of their other markets.
Though I did think it might be otherwise, you now seem to be like a lot
of tekkies - clueless about business issues.
|
No, you were making the claim that ROI was difficult to achieve with
linux/OSS. Claranet get ROI on their linux and OSS projects - thats WHY
they use them. Nice to see you've descended to the level of insulting my
intelligance though.
Please, dont try to sidestep by claiming that this was about a business
OFFERING open source products, this is about them *using* them. |
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Steve McIntyre
Guest
|
| Posted:
Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:37 am Post subject:
Re: Video editing in Linux? |
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In article <4180b88c.264827500@130.133.1.4>, SjT <NOT@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Most of the glaring issues with windows software is caused by linux
die-hards wanting to screw the system up for the rest of us anyway by
constantly looking for exploits
|
<and more crap like it>
Please take this out of uk.comp.os.linux; we're quite happy without
"advocacy" posts...
--
Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com
"Every time you use Tcl, God kills a kitten." -- Malcolm Ray |
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